Today, Joe Sanok speaks with Dr. Megan Warner on how to slow down.
We’ve created a conference where introverts can get energized and overachieving extroverts can learn to slow down. Visit Slow Down School here for more info.
In This Podcast
Click below to listen to the first podcast in this series, How To Slow Down To Spark Innovation With Alison Pidgeon.
Dr. Megan Warner tells us her experience of slowing down and the result of feeling energized and rested when she went back to work. She’s now learnt to include more ‘slow down’ moments in her life.
Tips to slow down in private practice:
- Raising rates
- Working out your ideal client
- ‘Abundance’ mindset – there’s plenty of work
Meet Dr. Megan Warner
Megan Warner is a clinical psychologist and the owner and founder of Guilford Psychological Services. Megan‘s training and experiences have culminated in a deep understanding of the value of scholarship and the importance of a mindfulness-based and compassionate practice. Therapists that remain engaged in the science of the field can offer a range of effective techniques and strategies. Mindful therapists are able engage fully with their clients and colleagues, and bring a spirit of compassion and non-judgment to their work. After running her private practice for a number of years, Megan recognized that she could better serve her community by founding a practice rooted in science and mindful compassion. Guilford Psychological Services unites these core tenets and is a practice that provides elevated and dynamic solutions for a broad range of clinical needs.
Megan specializes in trauma, mindfulness based approaches, and perinatal and postpartum mood and anxiety. In addition to her private practice, Megan is an Assistant Clinical Professor in the Department of Psychiatry at the Yale School of Medicine. She is also a wife and a mother to two young children. For more information, visit: https://meganwarnerphd.
Meet Joe Sanok
Joe Sanok helps counselors to create thriving practices that are the envy of other counselors. He has helped counselors to grow their businesses by 50-500% and is proud of all the private practice owners that are growing their income, influence, and impact on the world. Click here to explore consulting with Joe.
Pop 196 | How To Slow Down With Dr. Megan Warner[0:00] Music. [0:08] Is the practice of the practice podcast with joe sanok and aliso pidgeon session number one ninety six. [0:14] Music. [0:25] So i totally screwed up alison and i,
batch together all of that in the front and in back and parts of this podcast and somehow we missed the introduction.
For dr megan warner that megan’s interview is so awesome about slowing down and sometimes she took and it’s just its is nice to see people.
Growing their businesses hustling sprinting get me going and then realizing that their big ideas the big way that they’re gonna change the world be on just,
the individual counseling that those big ideas come more often than not when they slow down when they start to think about all these different areas in their life,
that they are being inspired and pulling from those into this one big idea about the slow down school and how i’ve been reading a lot about,
different religions and religious things and i was watching this thing on netflix of ten questions for the dali lama.
And also i was reading this book about some of the jewish origins of the gospels.
It’s interesting how every major religion has someway that they slow down that they reflects that they step back from the ordinary,
in their every day to connect discover the extraordinary and.
You can be inspired in so many different places are outside of counseling but if you don’t slow down it’s hard for your brain to we’ve all that together so today without any further ado i give you dr megan. [1:59] Music. [2:07] Hey michelle we have dr megan warner she is this awesome psychologists that has guilford psychological services bitches developing,
as well as she and i have been consulting for a while.
Megan has training and experience as the assistant clinical professor in the department of psychiatry at yale university school of medicine,
her phd in clinical psychology from texas a and m her pri doc residency was at yale university school of medicine and her post doc fellowship,
is in pt st at brown university medical school but even more importantly if she is mastering the art of slowing down megan welcome to the practice of the practice podcast. [2:47] Thank you so much for having i’m so excited to be here yeah i’m so excited to have you here to,
you know your practice was growing and a lot was happening and you sent me an email a couple of months ago about slowing down and for me that email just captured everything that i want to cover in this ten part series. [3:07] Take us back to connect what how things are going over the summer for you and then when you slow down some of the things that happened. [3:16] Will there yet so so i had been you know going to practice will start working together in the spring.
And everything’s going great was like a very hard to crack ass and is full i was feeling house feeling like i couldn’t separate like,
the excitement from that the excitement of the moment i’m from like the anxiety of the momentum in our near. [3:39] Can you like i’m rushing you kindly gonna are present so awesome kinda like having a couple of cups of coffee and using your energy and,
it’s amazing but it was starting to feel like i wasn’t as in control that feeling like the moment and had a hold on me instead of me having hold on momentum.
And they kept wish i could take a vacation and then start like if i do wish i could figure out where the planet,
and can i get to see my husband took my kids out of town for a couple of days to go visit the family as i can i’m gonna rock these three days i have i need to like take a break.
And my schedule like a salt float there don’t like to sell you know i have actually heard about that from i,
it’s a couple other people reference day and then i watched the tv show stranger things and they did the sensory deprivation in that show and they sent the email and like i have to do in so,
christina and i actually did it when we are in seattle john got mins marriage conference or partner conference.
So it was because of your email them okay if megan did and got this experience that i’m gonna try this thing so maybe take not able to what is that they have heard of a float. [4:50] Yes sir that’s amazing it’s amazing.
I think you don’t like a sensory deprivation room retained it depends on the it depends on the facility and there’s but one goal for the driven by a million times and always wondered and,
i looked it up and yes you going to this room and there’s a usually a shower and,
take a shower yrs off and on to this into the stock tank or this room it’s very low lighting like a blue light up.
Internal affairs july and it’s very intensely salted water i think they probably put,
i ridiculous amount of absence all in the water and it’s so much salt that you flow and i think they’re probably trying to stimulate like an in utero type in about.
Because you just lay there and what you can’t do anything but flour and it’s warm.
And it’s cozy and you can turn the light off its so there’s nothing but they just it’s completely like deprivation,
it’s very relaxing like did you did you find it relaxing yet so the first we did to the first time i went i was just so fascinated by the experience this or that experimenting with things so i was like floating there.
And i was like well i wonder how close my hand can get my face before i really see and i like drift salt water in my eyes so that i have to take a crap where’s the lakes lotto and could give you square root of people like me,
and so then i’m like.
Well i wonder like how long it would take for me to like flow from one side to the other for just push with one finger inside the first time like i was total monkey brain like. [6:20] I have this like great meditative experience that the second time for me,
was i was like okay i’m gonna try to be fully present and like just let myself just to be.
And it was amazing it shocked me how i can be there for an hour and pitch darkness and just like float around. [6:40] Yeah flies right time to time clothes flies so fast that goes in it over it was yours is like when you did the first time.
You know what’s funny and i love your story makes a lot better because i did the exact same thing i was like pushing myself back and forth you know battery,
charlie like out of press off with my toes and see if i could like kind of go the other side but it is just actually a very filter was very mindful and i felt so relaxed kind of playing in the space and like i was kind of an emotion that i was enjoying,
pain on myself side the switch but yeah i didn’t really like.
I was kind of playing your new like it was it was a playful space and it’s also hard to know because you have these thoughts like you practice mindfulness and it made me very aware of.
The interest is of the father was having that i didn’t want a house like,
thinking about the practice are taking about to do list since i was really making a conscious effort like you’re describing to,
sort of like scene about the job without letting go and get back to the warmth of the water and the pleasure of the float so.
At united a second time recently and i have some more like i had a kind of play around you knows or like at this kind of party copper like the good is like,
kicking myself around side to side and i play with a little spray bottle and flushed the color okay but eventually i selling and before i know it,
yeah it’s over at both times i phone asleep,
to like five minutes ago circulate what am i doing i’m sleeping in water when did they had the option of having music on it for says and how much i want to be completely silent then. [8:20] Is it going with it and the first one was this like mongolian chanting it was cool because you if you just had this one spot in the tub,
you can hear better else you couldn’t so you kinda just feeling florian losing his a wall and just like to move out of it and it was a mess with your mind because it was just like the sound crept,
and then it like letters that is wave of sound and so great and so mindful it’s so relaxing like to notice that have that be what you’re noticing instead of like,
i to do leicester it now grocery list or whatever i you’re only with the music or only with the darker human only with the spray bottle yeah what’s.
It’s important i think we leave in half without even though we’re play the use i think having little kids and a two year old,
five year old and they play all the time when you think about as adults like when do we have that chance to play to just like really be,
three of the business of the obligations i think i’m amazed as an adult is how much freaking work it is to be an adult and a parent like. [9:25] How do you incorporate play access other than your flow you had some kind of playfulness is that happened years or is that something that you just kind of observed in that moment. [9:35] Yeah yeah yeah both i think minutes it’s definitely something i observed and i had a lot of like centering moments and not float like moments sort of clarity like,
we will actually like live my life and part of it is harder participating more fully and the playfulness of,
of twenty seven year old and any one of the things i really love about mindfulness is that when i play with them i really,
play with them you know i can put everything aside and actually if we’re playing with claire we made pizza recently there whatever the hell it’s just like be fully one with them and the moment,
and it’s restorative if he its major.
Now it say restore it like how does that feel what is it they like you people used for an allergies what is it feel like it does to your insides when you fully step away from your business.
Yeah it feels like i’m getting my mind a bit of a break like and i think what i like your shirt of mine fullest to strengthen focus but i think there’s also the ability to be where you are that.
That lets you be free of focus of this kind of not more playful space like i wanna be strengthening my brain right now i actually wanna give it over,
three i’m gonna give it a rest from thinking and then it translates into my body like if i have if i have a rested brain.
I feel a little less kinda you know that i cannot service you like momentum,
and anxiety overlapping for me and i don’t want that i want to momentum in the process but i don’t want to feel stressed by it i just want to feel the rush of it but not the.
Education if that makes any sense so then after your float your husband’s gone for three days what else did you do to just kinda bounce back to or to just rest in that time any other kind of practices you did during that time. [11:20] Yeah it was so interesting so so you know i went into this series of like the set of days like okay now i’m going to vacation i’m gonna do it properly and i’m not gonna think about anything but it’s,
that’s a nice schedule a massage and i want to the farmers market and a ipod or around,
it was wonderful i can clean the house and organize but gradually what’s your it happened was i got distracted by all the stops i wanted to be working.
I was having this internal conflict know your not supposed to be working but i wanted to work because i feel so rested and restored so i did a little,
that work i did like one or two hours like i just enough that mean you’ll less worried about stuff i added you but i like i think i like,
watching netflix and you know went to bed early in.
Play top typhoon for myself like i really took care of myself and i really followed where i wanted to be a really respond to what i.
What a wine in for the.
Yeah clicking in yet when i think part of the series of slowing down is the idea of we go through kind of what we need to pause.
The main oven to some practices and then we experience moments of really being present.
And for me that pause the every weekend i turn off my phone i wanna leave and i don’t do any work stuff some and social media and check my email.
It is i try my best not think about working to be is present as i can but during that kind of pos phase. [12:51] There is that restless mind where i can actually go back to my email and actually go back to facebook and we know you’re not looking at facebook right now you’re not being a fishing you just playing with the kids and.
But it’s a thing as you feel that time of things whether it’s netflix or different things that you choose to do it makes it so much easier to move into that presence.
Exactly yeah i think i might have even gone to the gym but i certainly haven’t thought about like i need to go to the gym i need to do something to it actually i feel very very good. [13:25] So that we can i think that’s everything is like well look at that i am taking care of myself and enormously future plans like we have to practice it ourselves. [13:35] Yeah so so after those three days tell me what happened in your business after you slow down.
I just had a crazy i think it mildew because i had so much energy and i felt like standing on the mountain top and being like,
wow this of course of really work sienna i knew that but i had such and it was such an intense spike.
And goes you know it wasn’t even just energy was also satisfaction like i just felt i felt more centered and,
and happy about decisions i was making like i’ve been feeling good but i haven’t really taken the time to really,
reflect on the successes and you know kind of think about what i wanted to do looking forward i just feel the joint fallen and energize that was is fabulous,
that’s awesome to take me through then you get this energy this mountain top what happen next did you have ups and downs how did you keep that momentum going. [14:32] Yeah i just and i just kinda got back to it you know i’m in there with the week was to see how many clients scheduled and i just kind of kept i think what i think what i need what i needed and what i took that moment first always that i need to keep,
planning this is a moment these vacations whether there will micro moments of you know like i had you know another float since then it has another massages and.
No i took myself get my nails done the other day like little gestures to myself that are stored outside of court and the police.
Pretty late deliberately.
And insistently for myself like i know house activist for me so now i’m now i’m doing it because i always feel more rested and more center and better clinically. [15:14] So that’s you know one thing that god put in place of the other thing is you know the of the big inside i had an and the float tank was to do i wanna be living my life for and i’m rushing and tried it you know.
Fit in all these clients i reinstate two is like money is very seductive,
what rights of a hard time saying no to clients especially in this stage of the business to one another private pay case,
you know i actually want another private pay case because i wanna spend more time with my family and i don’t wanna be feeling over tax so sorry i said no a little more for that weekend i said no to work clients and,
i was a little more compassionate with myself about you know doing one thing at a time on the to do list this summer center space,
well i love you use the term the stage because i do feel like there are times that you just sprint full force but that means the lifestyle.
It’s like you can sustain that when i was working at the college full-time and then you’re working evenings and recording podcasts on sundays it’s like.
That hope getting to the point that i’m at people be like oh i want that its okay you working three days a week it’s like much of freaking work again they didn’t like it is like we’re three days a week the whole this whole time i hustle for a while.
But that’s where you hear that like hustle and to me that’s not a sustainable lifestyle for your own mental health but also for your client’s mental health. [16:36] That’s exactly right and actually it is the lifestyle thought that i was thinking about like in the float tank i was like okay i’m in this very centered space what,
what do i want my life to look like what would be a good number week how many times do i wanna try to lake prep dinner and,
you know gonna in a positive way not in a bird way but like what do i want it in our family evenings and how do i want or we can stick changing,
and starting to you know my focus shifted yeah it is a state like my focused on chef back like i thought about it like.
So like you know dance you know like things and then flour and right now i need to re center on our lifestyle.
Even as i grow to practice like it doesn’t have to be a choice but again i want to being control the moment you not have it control the,
i don’t think that’s feels were there any tools or mindset,
tips that you use to have start to look at that lifestyle need ways you priced things are how you decide who you’re going to come here not. [17:37] Get me a great question um,
yeah i think i think i’ve gotten a little more confident about raising my rates and being clear on who i wanna taking so i don’t i might have compassion for something on the phone but,
do i have enough high risk lane and seven and people are struggling in may not have no motion and energy. [17:59] Take some cases that have compassion for such that any stress or getting very,
delete bread and the mindset that i have i don’t live in abundance mindset there’s plenty of work for all of us it’s just it is just a matter of stages in,
people get their names out there but i don’t,
i need a free myself of that starvation mentality of that earlier stage when your new in my cases got all the cases like,
i don’t have to be at mentality anymore i have to liberate myself over.
From starvation mentality in abundance and not for people that are at that phase of me and i’m bootstrapping it i’m working so hard and i’m not getting the clients that i want. [18:42] Would you say they should slow down at that point or is it that you know just keeps printing and then at this phase you should start to have some of those self-care things with and what you do. [18:53] Yeah i think that’s it has interesting question and all of you i say hang in there because you can’t water but,
but i think if it’s feeling like you’re not running the sprint and the sprint is running do that i think it’s time to slow down.
But if you have the energy for the sprint and your invigorated by it and you have a per ass and your sort of seizing the world and by all means like,
run it is i think i think it to,
hands on the individuals like if your feeling flooded overwhelmed you know by the agitation problem and everything it’s time to stop in and look and word in and see what’s working and what’s not working and what’s. [19:36] What you wanna tell that for any of us to take a moment sleep,
it’s not that you write to write burned out either sure sure i know that for me when i was first launching my side practices when i was down in kalamazoo before i moved back to traverse city,
it wasn’t my side gig i was working assume he was at a group practice so it wasn’t my practice.
And i put in all this time to try to get referrals to match at the time it took insurance a match clients to the right insurance and finally i was like at the point i wanted,
and this one week i think i got three referrals and it was like that just like sent me over the edge like how my gonna do this because i am a fulltime job mrt full like,
and remember this moment the couch with christina,
i just broke down crying was just like this is too much and it’s so hard when you’ve tried so hard to get those clients and then finally you get on and you realize i need to like turn away or i need to raise my rates are need to limit my schedule it just,
it’s such a hard original it’s such a hard question paul it really is and i think it’s like you know when you get in the car for a really long time and you get out of the car,
and you still feeling icky rain pics of adjustment no like actually i’m not living anymore like it does take some adjustment it just and it’s really hard,
it’s very hard i think it’s a,
you know i’m interested in the house it i think this is a hazard of entrepreneurial set you know it’s just it’s an emotional challenge that,
that’s it like a private its a private stress in that for the entrepreneur it’s tough. [21:09] Yeah so when you look forward so two thousand seventeen at the time this recording it where engine two thousand seventeen hundred you have planned out where you’re gonna put your energy where you gonna pull back and retrieve slow down,
take us through how you think about your business and that way we have everything about this is this your comes to a close and you know my,
my to start availability is as i think a lot of us has you have is i still have a desire service please and and help people that call you know that’s a that’s a hazard for me because i need to stay is to stay on this.
Hottest space of being very clear with what i’m trying to take on or not take on and its it’s taking me away from wanting to brother practice with hiring consultants and things like that so so i focus for the next year is to try to really,
get a grip on the side of myself that urgently wants to say yes to people that really i’m not the only condition out there.
I’m not so yeah i’m not so ego you know in love with myself to think i’m the only person that can help such i need to really kind of get a grip on that and also to get it to get a grip on you know this a doctor this of money,
in balance with you know sure i wanna make more money but i can actually make more money if i don’t take a couple of these cases.
And i spent some time you know developing groups that i am in i am going we’re gonna start a dialectical behavior therapy group and january but i can get a lot more groups off the ground and alternately will be more profitable for the business if i stopped. [22:42] Thing is so many people yeah so that those are my two main like stop but you know falling of scrap of wanting to just no help everybody and.
And thank likely about this races at holy graphics on my consulting clients when they get to this point where they’re making the amount of income they want.
They’re working the amount they why often times it’s like how do i start to take things off my plate so that i can scale bigger,
i’m not having a jump it’s really difficult for people and so that could be adding people to a group,
act as i could be having groups like your launching that could be it no longer are you the one it’s taking all the phone calls and texts and how have you evaluated your use of time in order to continue to scale up and not have to work more hours. [23:29] Yeah you me how my how wanting it yeah or other things that you are looking outsourcing are the things that you’re looking at to bring in extra income outside of just that your time in something the sorts of things. [23:45] Yes yes definitely yeah i’m just looking at hiring contractors to help,
carrying some of the some of the cases that i can pick up and i have been twenty with the idea of someone answering the phone i think it’s a low investment like it’s not very expensive solution and i think you would help me,
specifically because i wouldn’t be actually in the interaction where i am having so much,
and to see that i’m overwhelmed with that so some definitely looking at you know may be dealing with the phone calls hiring are contractors and looking at the groups in the contractors as with,
thanks to help me continue my goal to slow down more like i think i can level up.
More exponentially the more i slow down like that’s the equation i’m really appreciating as if i can dial it back. [24:32] I’ll have more for energy and resources of all sorts to it to actually make a bigger difference in the community yeah,
and what i’ve found is that as a dial back and for most weeks just work tuesday wednesday thursday,
that’s my contractor is now coming know if i need to i need to catch him before thursday when he leaves in less it’s an emergency he’s probably and i can get back to me until next tuesday,
and so the people around you start to learn when you’re available when you’re not,
even just being able to ask my assistant to see can you handle this interest in this case your sony the referral for something or are they want to schedule in the email me instead of the intake person,
of just passed off to them so they can you call them according to this the to have her do that,
for a quarter of an hour i mean that’s crazy that’s like you five bucks out of my pocket that i’m paying her to do this and yeah. [25:29] So then it is time where i can send another claim. [25:33] Exactly i think you know we talk a lot about money issues right and it has a podcast and i had to work,
you know my own money and she is in and i thought about how some scheduling a vacation for early january that have this will be great if they publicly make me hear the that was the second,
you know that your second try to take off and already it’s been interesting it’s work,
to hold firm to that saving this morning i had to call you was trying to insist that we need to meet that week i was like no way i have to hold my ground on this like,
so i’m seeing the you know the insistence of my need to sort of like i gotta protect this time this vacation is to happen sort of like i had to evolve through the money issue stuff,
now i have to work through that you know protect my time and then slow it down stuff like that this is clearly where this is clearly the stage and then is only.
And i feel like that’s one of those things that,
it’s easy to slip away from that because you always have a client of like are you sure you’re not free that money across just that one person and then it’s like when someone says it could be free of that money a primary come in for that out,
and that is a vacation haha seems like my wife is florida every year with a group of her friends and.
Past years i’ve seen a client here and on the web and are consulting thing but then like my parents are somebody has to watch the girls,
and this year was like no like i am gonna be with my kids to hang out with them are gonna have a really big long fun kind of steak asian will do great things. [27:04] But look at my schedule like the days that i am working that week are like so filled already and now i’m like homages like some people won’t be able to see me until like late january how they can work with it but.
I’m gonna be a better clinician and i’m gonna be a better day had and i’m gonna be a better business owner if i create the life that i want and then works for the work in two k that schedule. [27:26] Exactly so i’ll send a couldn’t agree more gas so,
what in russia goal setting it specially said looking at your rates do you use any sort of formula to decide what you’re gonna charge based on your lifestyle how do you determine your rates.
Move but you know i haven’t done that and i don’t imagine i’ll do that now because of our lease for sat and this path i could certainly revisit that you know i set my rates mostly based on,
so here i summon first-rate i looked at what everybody was charging on psychology today and i went ten dollars higher,
because i wanted to make convey that i know i should be getting a little more,
you know what it’s just of its like i’m luxurious the fabulous come by and they were for me yeah that that’s how i started at,
and then i did ask around and i’ve met some colleagues since you know,
how is life it brings up something moments and i come across tighter like at stent playlist i’m charging up there in advertising,
so i am trying to increase to sort of like what some of my colleagues and it in the field that are in a fabulous have been charging for a while,
so [28:38] I’m i’m either for me no matter for real i think we try talk about this and consulting and i know sometimes it’s talked about on the,
you know i’m like secrets and stuff is that i can’t keep i can’t take all the people that are wanting to come right now so i am thinking about increasing my read again,
you know i think that one might help and yeah that’s sort of what i am i to it without a,
why that just really shows how it and i’m going process and its and i’m doing a valuation and you start with what you think is the best ray and the fair rate for what you do and then you,
you’ll be is it over time and evaluate that in so much of our businesses are that way where we just can’t think through what thing logical next step here. [29:22] Exactly so megan warner if there was one thing that you want to share with counselors around the world what would you want them to know. [29:32] I think it especially based on this conversation and thinking about your life lately and i think i would say is that you have to listen to your body and your,
your mind and your thoughts in your psyche and if you do you know if your feeling like things are not incompatible with things are not compatible with the life you wanna,
leave the time to you know stop and take a break slow down create a space for yourself truffle,
black so you can find what is the,
do you wanna house and inside is another way to say that is i think slowing down really isn’t investment goes in yourself and in your business and it’s worth making,
we also have this guilty feeling we shouldn’t take a vacation mission take a break but actually taking a break is good for this ass and its good for yo,
seven do it.
Well said megan dang dr macon warner her website is meganwarnerphd.com you can connect with her there thanks so much megan for being on the practice of the practice podcast.
Such a pleasure thank you joe. [30:33] Music. [30:41] So i’m doing this whole series about slowing down to spark innovation and there’s three videos to go along with it as well so that you can get the most at this series head on over to practiceofthepractice.com/slowdownvideo and you get those three videos about how to spark innovation,
what to do with those parts and the one thing that you can do this year thanks so much for letting interiors an inch of rain have a great day. [31:05] Music. [31:25] Special thanks that sounds sexy thank you for your music and this podcasts design after thirty. [31:33] With estimate of the gas with a publisher running. [31:38] Weather professional make sure if you need a professional to ship island and heading over to slow down school that have to find out more about this conference for doing. [31:46] Music.