Do you know what a brand style guide is? Why is it important to create one for your business? What are some of the most important elements to be aware of and make sure to ace in your guide?
In this podcast episode, Sam Carvalho speaks with Colin Jeffries about the difference between being a marketer vs. a provider.
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Meet Colin Jeffries
Colin has over a decade of experience helping businesses and people reach the right audiences at the right time with messages that galvanize to action. His background in digital marketing, content marketing, advertising, branding, strategy, and segmentation helps him bring a holistic perspective to helping organizations grow.
In addition to serving a broad range of healthcare practices and providers, Colin is recognized as a pioneer in direct-to-patient marketing for addiction recovery. He currently co-hosts The Rethink Marketing Podcast and leads marketing initiatives for BrightView, a comprehensive outpatient addiction treatment provider with more than 30 locations and 6,500 patients under care.
In This Podcast
- How B2C brands can learn effective marketing from B2B brands
- “Marketing isn’t a department”
- Healthcare, marketing, and Colin’s advice
- Colin’s advice to private practitioners
How B2C brands can learn effective marketing from B2B brands
To clarify, B2C stands for business-to-consumer and B2B stands for business-to-business.
The top three aspects that effective B2B brands get right in marketing are:
- Successful B2B brands usually do not talk down to prospects. Instead, they position themselves as helpers and they position the prospects as the hero and there they speak together on the process between them.
- B2B marketers understand the longevity of relationships. This means they have to create great buying experiences, have great customer support, and make sure the products and services on offer are applicable over the course of time instead of treating them as transactional.
- In B2B marketing, sales and marketing teams are usually much more aligned because they have to be.
One thing I love to see in B2B brands that I wish we could replicate much more in B2C is having marketing and sales integrate on the strategic plan knowing that there’s less finger-pointing. (Colin Jeffries)
“Marketing isn’t a department”
Any way that customers are impacted and [experience the business that could] change their perception of your business or what you do, that is marketing. To lock marketing up in their own department and say ‘you guys generate the business, we’ll handle everything else’ is a huge mistake. (Colin Jeffries)
Marketing covers not only what appears on your website and business cards, but also how your receptionist is received by clients, how you structure and send your emails and how you interact with vendors and clients, and so forth.
Any way in which your business makes an impact with a client all counts as marketing and should be treated with the same care and intention, because you would want your clients to have a holistic, excellent experience with your entire business, wherever they meet it, in person at your office or on their cellphones.
Healthcare and marketing
Healthcare and marketing is a moving target, as Colin discusses, in that it is not the same as how other businesses market themselves.
When it comes to people and healthcare, very few people go for preventative appointments and instead only go to the doctor or see a therapist after many years, when their average symptoms have compounded to the point where they struggle to function in their daily lives.
[Marketing agencies] don’t understand that the buying process is different, the customer experience or the patient experience is different and that how patients are doing research is different. There are just so many nuances with healthcare specifically that it’s really important to vet your agency. (Colin Jeffries)
Colin’s advice for those that are marketing healthcare:
- Talk to your patients, have conversations with them because it helps providers find out what is resonating with their patients, what their stories are, and how you can serve them better.
Often times as practice administrators or providers, we don’t have time to go and do that but by putting the right marketing person in place to have those conversations to develop that understanding is imperative and unfortunately often times that can’t be done by an agency due to healthcare regulations and that sort of thing. (Colin)
- The more you are on the same level as your customers, the more you can connect to their needs and what services they require from you, the better you can assist them and elevate the healthcare you provide.
Colin’s advice to private practitioners
Being a good marketer and being a good provider requires different skillsets. New patients will not come to your practice because you are a good provider, they will come to you because you are a good marketer and the flipside of that is also true: patients won’t stay at your practice because you are a good marketer, they’ll stay at your practice because you are a good provider.
Do not be afraid to ask for help with marketing if it is not in your skillset.
- How to Create a Brand Style Guide | MP 57
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Meet Sam Carvalho
Sam Carvalho is a graphic designer living in Cape Town, South Africa, with over five years of experience in both design and marketing, with a special interest and experience in the start-up environment.
She has been working with Practice of the Practice since 2016 and has helped over 70 therapist entrepreneurs take their practices to the next level by enhancing their visual branding. She loves working with a variety of clients on design-intensive tasks and is always up for a challenge!
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Welcome to the Marketing a Practice podcast with me, Sam Carvalho where you’ll discover everything you need to know about marketing and branding your business. To find out more about how I can help you brand new business visit www.practiceofthepractice.com/branding. And if you’d like to see some examples of my design work, be sure to follow me on Instagram at Samantha Carvalho Design.
[SAM]: Hey, thanks so much for joining us today on the Marketing a Practice podcast. Today, I have Colin Jeffries with us. Colin has over a decade of experience helping businesses and people reach the right audiences at the right time with messages that galvanize action. His background in digital marketing content, marketing, advertising, branding strategy, and segmentation helps him bring a holistic perspective to helping organizations grow. In addition to serving a broad range of healthcare practices and providers, Colin is recognized as a pioneer in direct to patient marketing for addiction recovery. He currently cohost the Rethink Marketing Podcast and leads marketing initiatives for BrightView, a comprehensive outpatient addiction treatment provider with more than 30 locations and 6,500 patients under care. Hi Colin. Thanks so much for joining us today.
[COLIN JEFFRIES]: Well, Sam, thank you so much for having me on the podcast.
[SAM]: Awesome. So can you tell us a bit about your background, your story and how you got to where you are now?
[COLIN]: Absolutely. So I studied marketing in college and came out, fortunately working in the field that I had pursued academically. I actually have worked in a variety of marketing roles, including for property management, for hospitality, for home improvement, and most recently for healthcare. And so that has given me, I think, a pretty unique perspective and understanding some of the key differences between those different verticals, the audiences within those verticals, that businesses are trying to reach. And then obviously the customer experience within those different verticals. In hospitality and events, people understand that a business will bend over backwards to make sure that they have a really good experience and the slightest complaint is addressed. Oftentimes in healthcare, that’s not the case. And so that has really, I think, helped kind of round out my perspective and my approach to marketing, to branding, to content and so on. And I’ll just say real quick for the past several years, I’ve been working in healthcare marketing in orthopedic sports medicine and in spine care. And then for the past several years, like you said presently, I am able to lead marketing for BrightView health and we are a comprehensive outpatient addiction treatment provider. So we serve essentially the most vulnerable and underserved population related to addiction treatment.
[SAM]: That’s awesome. And I think, like you said, that’s so important that you’ve kind of had that background now to discover how marketing is different in different industries, because obviously it’s not something that you can apply kind of a generic approach to all industries. That’s definitely tailored to the specific industry that you’re in.
[COLIN]: That’s exactly right. How customers perceive you, what they expect from you, honestly their presuppositions about your business and your industry as a whole are key to comprehending in order for your messaging to be engaging and effective. And I would say that’s no more true than in addiction treatment where there’s a lot of convoluted messaging. There are a lot of players, frankly, who are very insurance specific or cash pay specific if you will. And so folks who are the target audience of those messages are used to being frankly hung up on if they don’t have the right insurance, they’re used to being wait-listed, they’re used to having to submit information to like a lead aggregator and then having that information sold to lots of different providers and being spammed afterward.
And those are practices that would really turn off a customer in any segment, but particularly in that where you want help fast, you want help quickly, you want help so effective and so on and so forth. To be put through that rigmarole can be very off-putting and seeing how different those audiences are treated versus the audience of a hospitality or a hotel or an event center or something of that nature, that type of business, or even somebody who’s trying to lease apartments and so on and so forth, it’s just night and day.
[SAM]: Absolutely. And I’ve always thought that ever since I’ve kind of worked with counseling practices as well, it’s such a personal service, right? I mean, if you are someone coming for counseling or as you said, for help with addiction it’s probably taken so much courage to even get to the point where you’re willing to reach out to someone. So as you said, that process needs to be as easy as possible and as easy on the client as possible because you’re already in such a vulnerable place. That’s exactly right. So I know that one of your philosophies is how B2C brands can learn from effective B2B marketing. Obviously we’ve not spoken about how you’ve obviously had experience in kind of both worlds. So can you speak a bit more into that?
[COLIN]: Absolutely. So I think there are lots of different things that B2B brands do really well. And I’ll say effective B2B brands, the top three that are probably most relevant to this audience right now are, I would say first that successful B2B brands usually don’t talk down to prospects. What they do is they position themselves as helpers and they position the prospect as sort of the hero. And what that allows them to do is speak with their prospect on a peer to peer basis. Not all B2B brands do this, but very effective ones definitely do. And unfortunately, in healthcare specifically related to doctors and surgeons, but I’m sure the same thing is true with counselors is oftentimes we want to be the hero. We want to make sure that customers are looking up to us, that they’re respectful of us, that they recognize we’re the best or we’re the leading or where the cutting edge or where the whatever adjective you want to throw in there.
And sure, B2B brands have to maintain a reputation. Sure, they have to be looked up to and respected within their industry and that sort of thing, but that doesn’t come at the expense of talking down to your customers. So the second thing that I think B2C marketers can learn from great B2B marketers is that B2B marketers really have to understand the longevity of relationships. So that means they have to create great buying experiences. They have to have great customer support. And obviously they have to make sure that the products or services that they’re providing are applicable over the course of time versus just recognizing, okay, this is more of a transactional relationship. Unfortunately, I’ve seen a lot of B2C brands get caught up in the math of marketing where they think, “Okay, I need X number of new customers, which means I need Y clicks. And I need this many calls from those clicks and I have to serve this many impressions to get those clicks, to get those calls, to get those customers.”
And they’re not thinking about, “Yes, I’m filling up the bucket over here, but I’m losing lots of customers over here,” B2B brands, again, successful ones with solid marketing teams tend to understand that this customer is not coming in and buying from me one time, especially in software. They’re coming in and they’re buying from me every month or they’re buying from me every quarter or whatever the situation is. So understanding the longevity of those relationships is absolutely key. The third thing is that in B2B sales marketing teams are usually much more aligned because they have to be than in B2C. And so one thing I love to see in B2B brands that I wish we could replicate much more in B2C is having marketing and sales integrate on the strategic plan. Knowing that there there’s less finger pointing at marketing from sales about, “Ah, you gave me bad leads. I can’t close.” And there’s less finger pointing from marketing to sales saying, “We gave you all these leads. You couldn’t close them. What’s going on?”
With B2B, oftentimes in successful situations, they’re very integrated. So they understand, “Okay, here’s the strategic plan. Here’s what needs to happen from a messaging perspective to make sales more effective. Here’s what needs to happen from a longevity and a patient being in healthcare, a customer being non-healthcare I guess.” For this conversation, we’ll say patient, when they call what needs to happen with the patient experience when we’re interacting with them. And I recognize a lot of healthcare practices don’t have “salespeople” per se, but oftentimes the physician or the clinician or the nurse or the practice administrator, or maybe they have a community liaison or a community outreach manager or something of that nature where they are going around, looking for referrals.
So really understanding how is that person best supported. What does the audience want to hear? Because lots of times there are very different segments from an audience perspective that want to hear different things. If you’re working with a primary care doctor versus a specialist versus somebody who’s a clinician who treats folks with severe trauma, the things that matter to them when they’re making a referral to you, chances are they’re very different. So if sales can understand that and then iterate and interact with marketing to create materials and messaging and a pipeline and that sort of thing that meets those demands, that’s huge. Again, lots of things that B2B marketers do effectively and do very well that B2C marketers can learn from, but I would say for this conversation, those are probably the top three that come to mind.
[SAM]: So those are some awesome tips. Thanks so much. And for those of you who are on the move or yes, who may be driving or walking while listening to this, we’ll have all those points listed in the show notes. And yes, I think just to touch on point one, specifically, I know over at Practice of the Practice, we always kind of encourage people to not focus too much on their credentials, especially when it comes to the content on their website and kind of how they present themselves and their bio and things like that. Because I think as you said, they have a tendency to kind of list all their credentials first and foremost, because obviously you want to show that you’re educated and you’re reliable, but to kind of first speak to the pain points of the client and to kind of meet them where they’re at as opposed to, as you say, kind of elevating yourself above them. So I think that’s a great way to put it.
[COLIN]: Well, in lots of times somebody will visit your website and if you have myriad information about CBT, let’s say, they may or may not have any idea what that means. And you might even spell it out and say cognitive behavioral therapy, and they still might not know what that means. So being able to explain what you do in layman’s terms, in a way that’s approachable, not that you’re talking down to them, “Hey, you don’t understand what CBT is. You dumb, dumb. So let me explain it to you.” But rather just writing to them in a way that talks about we use exploration and questions and the Socratic method and reflection. Like different elements that people sort of understand. Socratic method, people might not understand, but, so that was probably a bad example, but basically, on a peer to peer level of what you do, what you mean, and how it helps, like it’s huge.
[SAM]: Yes, absolutely. Couldn’t agree more. So you spoke into this a bit in your third point there about how you said that sales and marketing should be aligned, but something that you also kind of ran by is that marketing isn’t a department. So what do you mean when you say that?
[COLIN]: That’s a great question. So this really comes from my personal experience working in marketing and the frustration that comes from driving clicks to the website, driving phone calls, driving what we’ll call new customer or new patient inquiries and realizing that when you’re sitting on hold for 10 minutes before someone picks the phone up, that’s a huge turnoff for potential customers or potential patients. When you walk in the front door and the receptionist is on their phone and they don’t even look up when you walk in, they don’t greet you, that’s extremely off-putting for new patients, new customers. When in a service-based business, when the technician shows up to your door and their shirt is wrinkled, and they have BEO and they don’t even greet you, they’re just like, “All right, what am I doing here?” That’s extremely off-putting as well.
And the list goes on, but all of those things, while they’re not perceived as being “marketing,” they are. Any way that customers are impacted and it changes their perception of your business or what you do, that’s marketing. And to sort of lock marketing up in their own department and say, “You guys generate the business, we’ll handle everything else,” is a huge mistake. Marketing covers, like I said, your call center or your receptionist or your emails, how you interact with vendors, how you interact with clients, obviously, but it pertains to operations. It’s not just, “Hey, you guys up in the marketing department, make sure we get better business.” It’s all about customer experience or patient experience, in healthcare. And I sort of joke that 15 years ago there was the phrase ‘customer service is not a department.’ And I think over the next several years, we’ll see marketing is not a department. I don’t know if I coined that. I don’t think I read it anywhere, but I’m sure I’m not the first person to say that, but it’s so true because we have to recognize that in today’s culture of pulling your phone out and having the entirety of human knowledge and endorsements, recommendations, ratings, et cetera, available at your fingertips at the push of a button.
We can’t just be marketing, we can’t just be like, hold up in our offices thinking, “Ah, we just need to drive more demand.” No, no. We need more demand, but we also need to make sure that the experience holistically is excellent.
[SAM]: Such good points. I think, yes I’ve also touched on this previously, but kind of, as you mentioned, every touch point with the customer is an impression on your brand. And I often speak into the importance of having a brand style guide and obviously this is getting more towards the visual side of things, but it’s also the theoretical side of things and how important it is to kind of establish that in the beginning, how you’re going to, as you say, interact with customers. And it runs across everything from your logo design to your interior design of your office to as you said the personality your receptionist is going to have towards your customers. And so that is so, so important. And I think it also speaks into the point, too, that you had of learning from B2B, which is ensuring that longevity of your relationship with your customers. That you’re not just thinking of a one time interaction, but that you’re actually forming that lifelong relationship.
[COLIN]: That’s exactly right. And you didn’t specifically say this, but you really alluded to it strongly is that consistency. You wouldn’t want somebody to see your marketing materials and have them be very friendly and very warm and very engaging and down to earth and then they show up to your business and the inside of your office is sterile and bland and dark. I mean, what you said is exactly right, Sam.
[SAM]: Absolutely. I think consistency is one of the most powerful branding tools. So another thing you kind of speak into is why healthcare specifically, healthcare marketing is a moving target. So what can marketers do about that?
[COLIN]: Healthcare is I think very unique in the aspect of so much of marketing is basically here’s a product or service and the person who is your target audience is the one ultimately paying for it. Healthcare is so unique because oftentimes there’s this gamesmanship that happens with insurance. So particularly for Medicaid and Medicare patients, they might not really care what your pricing model looks like, what your outcomes model looks like and so on. And so that can be really challenging versus having somebody come in and say, “Okay, I’m either going to pay with this out of my cash or my debit card or my credit card. And it’s coming out of my account.” Well, if I have already hit my deductible and insurance is paying for it maybe I’m not doing a lot of research. Maybe I’m just doing this because I need to get this done by the end of the year, before my deductible resets and you guys can handle it. And so it is much different than a lot of other even B2C style marketing.
The other thing is that healthcare, oftentimes there’s no research that’s done. And this can be very nuanced because if I have a heart attack in the US, I call 911 or someone else does. I guess if I have the heart effect, they would call 911 on my behalf. I’m not doing any research about local cardiology outcomes, which cardiologist specializes in heart attack victims like the one that I had and so on and so forth. The flip side of that is also true where if you’re marketing for let’s say counseling or orthopedics or nephrology, something where people have a lot of time to do research, it’s absolutely crucial that you have a great SEO strategy that you have an excellent reputation management strategy and so on and so forth so you can appeal to those people.
On most businesses, you have to maintain all of those things and you don’t get the sort of, one-offs where they’re making an emergency call, let’s say. And then the worst part of that is in the US anyway, lots of people wait until the very last minute to get healthcare. They’re not coming in for their preventative appointments by and large. They’re not seeing their primary care doctors regularly by and large, or dentist or orthodontist or optometrist, whatever the case may be. And so that leads to lots of what I would call crisis health care. So instead of waiting to see a counselor after something traumatic happens, I bottle that up inside for a decade or two decades and then all of a sudden I’m faced with exacerbations of that condition, like anxiety or depression or something else.
And then when I go see a counselor, finally, they have to route through all of this stuff to get down to the root cause rather than if I would’ve just come in after that and be seen and be treated. It makes it a lot easier. So we really don’t see that in many other instances. When somebody wants a new phone, they go buy a new phone. They don’t wait 10 years to go get a new phone. When a business needs a new accounting software, they go get a new accounting software. They don’t wait 10 years to go get a new accounting software recognizing the whole time, “Hey, this is a problem. We should get this fixed.”
So I think there are lots of considerations that healthcare marketers have to have. And unfortunately, all too often marketing agencies who don’t specialize in healthcare, or don’t know a lot about healthcare and don’t understand the differences and the nuances of healthcare compared to other verticals, will come in and try to sell physicians or practice administrators, or executive leadership teams at different practices, and a lot of solo practices, too. I’ve seen this with dentist, orthodontist, chiropractors, et cetera. They’ll come in and just say, “Hey, we got new business for this pizza shop or this automotive dealer or the SAS business, but we can do the same thing for you.” And they don’t understand that the buying process is different, the customer experience or the patient experience is different, that how patients are doing research is different. There are just so many nuances with healthcare specifically that it’s really important to vet your agency.
[SAM]: So now that you’ve kind of painted the picture of health care marketing, what would kind of your advice be to what marketers can do about that situation?
[COLIN]: Absolutely. That’s a great question. I think the biggest thing for me personally, is talk to your patients. And I don’t mean talk down to them. I don’t mean send surveys out to them. I mean, like come out of your conference room or your war room or whatever, come out of your office and don’t talk to them as a clinician, don’t talk to them as a marketer, but just have conversations with them. One of the reasons COVID has been so difficult for me professionally is because I love getting out of the office and talking to new patients, because it helps me understand what’s resonating with them. What are their stories? How am I able to serve them better? And the way that I can do that is by really knowing sort of what makes them tick, what frankly is a turnoff to them, what’s off putting, and then also what’s engaging, what messaging can I tweak? What I’m FAQs can I answer? What questions do they have that I’m not providing solutions to and so on and so forth.
That’s huge. And so oftentimes as practice administrators or as medical providers, we don’t have time to go do that. But putting the right marketing person in place to have those conversations to develop that understanding is absolutely imperative. And unfortunately, oftentimes that can’t be done by an agency due to healthcare regulations and that sort of thing. And frankly, it’s just easier to say, “Hey, my name is Colin. I work here. I’d really just love to talk to you about your story and your experience,” versus my, “My name is Colin. I worked for this marketing agency, and we’re doing some market research, and we’re curious to hear what your position is on these different topics and how are your experiences and that sort of thing.” It’s just less down to earth. It’s less authentic. And I think the biggest thing is just the more you know your customers, the more you are on the same level, the more you’re appear, if you will, with your patients, with your customers, the more you can address their needs. And that’s really what marketing is all about; is discovering needs and then addressing them appropriately.
[SAM]: Absolutely. And I think I’ve always kind of thought that counselors have that unique privilege of being able to tap into the minds of their clients directly, obviously in counseling sessions, obviously without, as you said keeping HIPAA-compliance in mind. But as you say, it kind of keeping that marketing hat on while you’re in the counseling session and not only being the counselor and kind of touching on that person’s experience and what led them to your practice specifically and how you can kind of replicate that.
[COLIN]: Exactly. I’m not saying sacrifice patient care for marketing, but that’s exactly right. Counselors oftentimes know their audience better than anyone else. And oftentimes you’ll notice trends that, and counselors should be trained to do this, recognize trends, recognize themes and stories, that sort of thing. And so if you can pull those out and tease those out a little bit from your own marketing perspective, there’s a massive, massive advantage that you have over someone who’s hiring a local marketing agency with zero understanding of who their customer is.
[SAM]: Absolutely. Sure. So I think you’ve given us a lot to think about and some great valuable information here today. So thanks so much for that. And Colin, if people wanted to get in touch with you, or if they wanted to hear a bit more about your insights, where can they go to do that?
[COLIN]: Absolutely. So I, co-host a podcast called Take Five, the Rethink Marketing Podcast. You can listen to it on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, all the places where you get your podcasts, or you can go to therethinkmarketingpodcast.com and connect with me there, listen to a lot of the content there. LinkedIn is my social media of choice. So it’s just linkedin.com/in/colin, [C O L I N], Jeffries, [J E F F R I E S]. I’d love to stay in touch and see what your audience is doing, and obviously, hopefully interact with them on that platform as well.
[SAM]: Awesome. So we’ll have all those links in the show notes and be sure to check out The Rethink Marketing Podcast if you’d like to hear more of what Colin has to say on marketing specifically within healthcare. And Colin, if every private practice owner in the world were listening right now, what would you want them to know?
[COLIN]: I think the biggest thing is just being a good marketer and being a good provider require different skillsets. Net new patients don’t come to you because you’re a good provider, meaning that they’re not otherwise connected to your practice. So if you were providing a great experience and your current clients are bringing in friends and family, that’s fantastic, that’s expected, but net new patients, folks who haven’t heard of you previously will not just come to your practice because you’re a good provider. They’ll come to you because you’re a good marketer. And the flip side of that is also true that patients won’t stay at your practice because you’re a good marketer. They’ll stay at your practice because you are a good provider. And so understanding that it’s not incumbent on providers to be good marketers, it’s incumbent on them to be good providers, right. To come in on marketers to be good marketers. So the biggest thing I would say is, and I’m not I’m pitching a marketing agency or anything of that nature, but I would just say, don’t be afraid to ask for help for marketing. Obviously resources like this podcast and other podcasts and blogs and things of that nature are great places to get marketing advice. But if marketing is not your skillset, don’t be afraid to ask for help. And just to reiterate, recognizing the difference between being a great marketer and being a great medical provider or a great clinician.
[SAM]: Awesome. Thanks so much for all the valuable information that you’ve shared with us today. And thanks again for being on the podcast.
[COLIN]: Thank you so much for the opportunity. I really enjoyed our conversation today.
[SAM]: Once again, thank you so much to Therapy Notes for sponsoring this show. It makes notes, billing, scheduling, and tele-health a whole lot easier. And if you’re coming from another EHR, they make the transition really easy. Therapy Notes will input your client’s demographic data free of charge during your trial so you can get going right away. Use the promo code, [JOE], that’s [J O E] to get two free months to try out Therapy Notes for free.
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