John Dennis on Having a Business and Being a Christian | FP 36

John Dennis on Having a Business and Being a Christian | FP 36

Has God put you on a new path in your business? How can life-changing events put you on a path to something that you’re actually really passionate about? As a Christian, do you struggle with certain business elements?

In this podcast episode, Whitney speaks to John Dennis about having a business and being a Christian.

Meet John Dennis

John DennisJohn is a Co-owner and the Chief Clinical Officer of Parenting & Family Solutions. As a licensed professional counselor with over 15 years of experience, he specializes in both marriage and family counseling for individuals, couples, children, and adolescents.

He focuses on working with anxious teens and adults, couples who are struggling to connect with one another using Level-2 Gottman Training, and those dealing with grief and loss. He is the host of the On The Couch Podcast (www.pfsonthecouch.com), a mental and behavioral health show in its 2nd season.

Visit his website and connect on Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, and Instagram. Listen to his podcast here.

Email John at jdennis@parentfamilysolutions.com

In This Podcast

Summary

  • Majority interests
  • Delineating who’s doing what
  • Running a business in the midst of COVID-19
  • On the Couch Podcast
  • What every Christian counselor should know

Majority interests

John follows Dave Ramsey and his EntreLeadership concept. Ramsey talks a lot about how a partnership is the only ship that doesn’t float and at the end of the day you can’t be deadlocked, somebody has to have the controlling say to keep moving forward. John’s business partner has the majority interests. It didn’t really matter to him what the split was, he knows himself enough to know that his business partner is much more business-minded and, in addition, he had stayed in Pennsylvania and had his practice structure in place in terms of office space and some of the branding. He was originally Parenting Solutions and then together they became Parenting and Family Solutions.

Delineating who’s doing what

They have hired a number of counselors as independent contractors and are continuing to hire now even now. It’s basically set up as John is the chief clinical officer, handling the clinical supervision, reports, looking over files, signing off things, etc. and his partner handles the business side of things. They’ve put profit first in place and his partner handled the bank accounts, paycheck protection plan, EIDL etc…all of the businessy stuff. It’s been such a blessing as John and his partner get along really well.

Running a business in the midst of COVID-19

Business can be like building an airplane while flying it and COVID-19 completely changed the shape of the airplane. As business owners and clinicians, a lot of people are scrambling to figure out the insurance side of things and are having to put out all sorts of new content regarding COVID-19. It’s stressing a lot of people out and it is not less work at all. It feels like going from a sprint into a marathon.

It’s going to be okay, take a deep breath, you don’t have to do everything all at once. Taking that deep breath is so important when feeling overwhelmed and busy. Be intentional about self-care and where you spend your time.

On the Couch Podcast

John’s podcast, On the Couch, is aimed at educating the general public on any topic that he feels connects in any way to mental and behavioral health. John is really interested in finding cool, interesting products, treatment methods, and thought leaders in the mental health community and tries to highlight things that people may not know about and connect listeners to them.

What every Christian counselor should know

You can have a business and be a Christian. And it’s not this like, sleazy, you know, tax collector like Zacchaeus or, you know, snake oil, used car salesman kind of thing, that you can do both. And it’s okay to be good at it and be successful at it and be confident in that.

Useful Links:

Meet Whitney Owens

Whitney Ownens | Build a faith-based practiceWhitney is a licensed professional counselor and owns a growing group practice in Savannah, Georgia. Along with a wealth of experience managing a practice, she also has an extensive history working in a variety of clinical and religious settings, allowing her to specialize in consulting for faith-based practices and those wanting to connect with religious organizations.

Knowing the pains and difficulties surrounding building a private practice, she started this podcast to help clinicians start, grow, and scale a faith-based practice. She has learned how to start and grow a successful practice that adheres to her own faith and values. And as a private practice consultant, she has helped many clinicians do the same.

Thanks For Listening!

Feel free to leave a comment below or share this podcast on social media by clicking on one of the social media links below! Alternatively, leave a review on iTunes and subscribe!

Faith in Practice is part of the Practice of the Practice Podcast Network, a network of podcasts that are changing the world. To hear other podcasts like Empowered and Unapologetic, Bomb Mom, Imperfect Thriving, Marketing a Practice or Beta Male Revolution, go to practiceofthepractice.com/network.

Podcast Transcription

[WHITNEY]:
The Faith in Practice podcast is part of the Practice of the Practice podcast network. A network of podcasts seeking to help you start, grow, and scale your practice. To hear other episodes like the Imperfect Thriving podcast, Bomb Mom podcast, Beta Male Revolution, or Empowered and Unapologetic, go to practiceofthepractice.com/network.

Welcome to the Faith in Practice podcast. I’m your host, Whitney Owens, recording live from Savannah, Georgia. I’m a licensed professional counselor, group practice owner and private practice consultant. In each week, through a personal story or amazing interviews, I will help you learn how to start, grow, and scale your private practice from a faith-based perspective. I’m going to show you how to have an awesome, faith-based practice without being cheesy or fake. You too can have a successful practice, make lots of money, and be true to yourself.

Today I wanted to take a few minutes to talk about the private practice Facebook group that I run, specifically for those that are running a faith-based perspective and growing their business. The group is called Faith in Practice. So, you can look it up in the Facebook, and I’ll try to post a link in the show notes that you can quickly look at that. But it is a free group of people that are growing their practices. So, we’ve got some people that are in the new stages. We even have some people that are in graduate school. We’ve got people who have group practices, and they’re growing those, but it’s a place for us to connect not only on business aspects and resources we can provide for one another, but on the faith aspect as well, because sometimes our questions are a little different than some of the other groups out there. And so, I want a place for us to throw those questions and get responses from one another. Also, within this group, I provide a lot of material which is all free, which is awesome for you guys. And I love just connecting with everybody through the group. I get on there regularly – probably two, three times a week and do Facebook Lives on relevant things that are going on in our world, or resources that I’m finding. Sometimes I’ll go on there and give you some podcast information before the episode’s released because it was a really good interview, or something I found really interesting that I think that you’ll enjoy. So, I do those regularly.

Sometimes I do quick interviews with other consultants or other people that I think would be helpful for you to hear from and provide materials like resources or handouts, or maybe you’re looking for how do I track time for my assistant? Or how do I create pay tiers? Or how do I help clients with different clinical situations? We throw all that in there. We also have a lot of people in there that are podcasting. And so, we’re able to talk about interviewing one another and helping each other out in our big ideas. So, if you’ve been looking for a group to connect with other practice owners that are also doing faith-based practices, look in the Facebook groups for Faith in Practice and you’ll find us. You’ll have to answer a couple of quick questions and you’ll be right in the group. So anyway, I want you to go check that out. If you have questions, concerns, you can send me an email at whitney@practiceofthepractice.com. Today’s episode is episode number 36. I interview John Dennis. He has a private practice, but he’s also made some big moves in his life and set things up in a very great way. And so, you can kind of learn about the way he set up his practice with his business partner, and the way he’s doing his life of faith. So, let’s jump right into the episode: John Dennis on having a business and being a Christian.

You’re listening to the Faith in Practice podcast. On today’s episode, I have John Dennis. He is the co-owner and the Chief Clinical Officer of Parenting and Family Solutions. As a licensed professional counselor with over 15 years of experience, he specializes in both marriage and family counseling for individuals, couples, children, and adolescents. He focuses on working with anxious teens and adults, couples who are struggling to connect with one another and uses the Level 2 Gottman training, and those dealing with grief and loss. He is the host of the On The Couch podcast, a mental and behavioral health show and it is in its second season. Hey, John, how are you?

[JOHN]:
Hey. Hey, Whitney. How’s it going?

[WHITNEY]:
Good, good. Glad to have you on the show today.

[JOHN]:
Yeah. Thanks for having me on.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. So, let’s just go ahead and kind of talk about your experience from getting your degree and kind of starting your practice, and tell us about your journey to where you are now.

[JOHN]:
Sure. So, I got my degree from Regent University back in… I think it was ’05 – seems like eons ago now. And yeah, moved up to Pennsylvania. I was living there after undergrad and grad. I went to Messiah College so kind of moved back into the area where my alma mater was, and, you know, kind of did the thing where you work for an agency, getting your license. And then once I got my license, joined a group practice and was an individual counselor primarily there, working with teens and kids. And then about the time we had our first child, we had a lot of medical issues and a lot of things went sideways, and really needed to look at making a jump. I grew up going to Virginia Beach my whole life and really love it. It’s sort of like a second home for us. So, we had looked at getting towards that area of Virginia, and landed in the eastern shore of Virginia, which is, most people aren’t aware of what it is or where it is, but it’s that Delmarva Peninsula there. And I was working for an agency there and when I had made the jump, I had transitioned my caseload to a good friend of mine, who is now my business partner and throughout, you know, I’d stayed in touch with him. I’d transferred the caseload and then stayed in touch when we moved down to Virginia for about four years. And you know, we always kind of joked like, man, we should have gone into business, we should have really done something with this, you know, it’s just a missed opportunity. And then, as fate would have it, or faith would have it, things started to materialize with family needs. My brother was diagnosed with cancer and around about the same time my father in law was diagnosed with cancer, and we really started to look at okay, I think we need to go back to Pennsylvania. And so, I called him up and we were like, okay, it seems like it’s gonna be a real thing. Let’s do this, you know. Prayed about it, thought about it, and it made sense. So, we’ve started to put things in place to make the jump. So yeah, that’s kind of the Cliff’s Notes version, I guess I would say.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. Well, I’m sure it was a scary time, right. I mean, you’re settled in somewhere that you really loved and then you’re having to move back to somewhere, another place you love, but just in a different kind of way. I’m sure it was kind of scary at the time.

[JOHN]:
Oh, definitely. Yeah, I mean, there was a lot of a lot of fear and then sort of the leap of faith kind of idea of like, okay, like, we’re really pushing all the chips in here, and praying that this comes through, and trusting that it was in God’s plan and, truth be told, with the way everything was going with my brother and his cancer, it was terminal and we knew that. And same with my father in law, so it was almost at a point of like, I don’t care if it’s gonna work out or not, I have to go. I’ll figure it out on the other side. But yeah, a lot of fear.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, yeah. Well, I’m glad you did that and took that leap of faith and I’m sure it was worth it.

[JOHN]:
Definitely.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. Okay, so then you meet up with your old friend and y’all start a practice together. And so how did you create the business, and how did you do it together? And then… I know we’ve kind of talked a little bit about faith being a part of what you do, how did you create a practice that also felt authentic to your faith and values?

[JOHN]:
Sure. Well, in starting to really look at our options when… I think it was Christmas and late winter of 2017, we were pregnant with our second child on the way, it was due in May, and found out right around that time about my brother’s cancer and so we just had a lot of things up in the air, and started to look at our options. And we realized that we needed to get back to Pennsylvania and sort of be in between my wife’s family and my family, to sort of position ourselves to help take care of things for the future. And this was the one that made the most sense, you know, it was the one that I was the most passionate about. It seemed to click, you know, the fact that it had always kind of been there, somewhat as a joke between my friend and business partner and then yeah, it was like, okay, this is very real.

So the way things went, I’m trying to remember, I think I had kept my Pennsylvania license, I just moved it to like inactive status, and so I had to quickly catch up on CEUs – because they had changed a couple of the regs with like ethics training or trainings on mandated reporting or things like that – so I had to quickly squeeze some CEUs in and fire off my application so the state of Pennsylvania. And around that same time I stumbled across Joe Sanok and Practice of the Practice… I was talking with Alison about this earlier, Alison Pidgeon, and yeah, I just happened to cross it again, you know, as faith would have it. And started to just gobble up all the information that I could and meet with my business partner on okay, how are we gonna set this up? What’s it going to look like? So, we really started diving into the nuts and bolts of like, the branding and the name and the tax ID number and the website, you know, all the social media stuff, all of those things. So I was kind of running in 1000 different directions all at once, making little bits of progress here and there to the point that, okay, then we came up after my son was born and looked at a house, and put an offer in, and it started to really, really become a reality once that happened. And then yeah, made the jump and I think I literally started work the week after we moved. Yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
Wow. Yeah, that’s a lot of things going on. I mean, you know, they say, don’t go through too many of the big stressors at once, I’m trying to remember I think it’s a new job, have a child and get a new house, and you accomplished all of them in a very short time.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, I mean, a lot of times I kind of joked like, yeah, we’ll just take the whole left side of the life stress checklist menu, like we’ll just, you know, take one of everything. How about it?

[WHITNEY]:
Right. Isn’t that how it works, though? It’s like, those are when God grows our faith. It’s like we have to be in those places of need to actually look to him sometimes.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it’s definitely, you know, the storm has rolled in and the boat’s rocking and you’ve got nothing left and you’re just, you know, okay, fine, please. Clearly I’m not good at steering this, please help me.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, that’s so right. Yeah. So, the business – do you and your partner own it 50/50 – is that how you split it?

[JOHN]:
No, actually, we set it up… he has the majority interests. So, I also follow Dave Ramsey quite a bit. And I know he talks on EntreLeadership a lot about you know, partnership is the only ship that doesn’t float and at the end of the day, you can’t be deadlocked. Somebody has to have a controlling say, so that you can, you know, keep moving forward. And I don’t know, I feel like it was worth it to me; it didn’t really matter to me, the split, in terms of like, no, I have to have the controlling say or it has to be 50/50. I know myself enough to know that my business partner is much more the slow and steady, and the business minded, and crunching the numbers, and things like that. In addition, he had stayed in Pennsylvania and had his practice throughout. So, he already had a lot of the structure in place in terms of the office space and somewhat of the branding. So originally, his was Parenting Solutions and then we became Parenting and Family Solutions, which is what we are today.

[WHITNEY]:
Oh, nice. Nice. I like that. So how do y’all delineate? Like, who’s doing what, as owners of the business?

[JOHN]:
Sure. I mean, I would say we’re a pretty fairways into stage two, you know, in terms of how Joe talks about it with, you know, stage one, you’re bootstrapping and you’re wearing multiple hats and things like that. And we still have that to some extent. But we have hired a number of counselors as independent contractors, and are continuing to hire even now, I think we have like three interviews tomorrow. But we basically set it up that I’m the chief clinical officer, so I handle the clinical supervision and any reports to children and youth, and looking over the files, and signing off on that stuff. And he handles more of the business side of things. So, we’ve put in place a profit first, so he worked really hard on getting all that set up. And you know, he did the bank accounts, or you know, especially now with the paycheck protection plan and the EIDL I think it is, like, he handled all of that, thank the Lord. So yeah, we kind of split it where like he handles the business-y, purchasing, number crunching end of things and I handle the supervision and the clinical stuff and most of the social media type of thing.

[WHITNEY]:
That makes having a partner sound so nice.

[JOHN]:
It really does. And it’s really been such a blessing because, you know, he and I get along really well. It’s interesting because we weren’t like, you know, best buds in college. We traveled in similar circles. I played lacrosse in college and his roommate, I played lacrosse on Messiah’s team with him. And so, we knew each other and had hung out here and there. But yeah, it’s worked out beautifully. We get along really well. He grounds me. He is able to pull in the rains and be like, okay, I think we need to do this instead or I’m a little concerned about this, and I’m more of the like, ADHD like, hey, let’s… what about this? Have you thought about this? You know, and a lot of times coming up with new projects to drown myself in.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. So how many hours a week would you say you devote to the practice? And are you actually seeing clients at the practice too?

[JOHN]:
Yeah, yeah. Right now, I have a pretty full caseload, I would say, throughout the week. And I would say, honestly, I don’t even know. I don’t even know that I could quantify how many hours I’m actually devoting just because my brains kind of always going. But yeah, right now, full caseload and then supervision once a week. Yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
And I get this question a lot, actually, what would you consider a full caseload?

[JOHN]:
I’d say, like 20, 25 a week, something like that. And it’s, yeah, it’s usually in and around there. And I do some trainings every now and again, and obviously I’ve got the podcasts, so I’m doing interviews for that. And then, with the Gottman counseling, we do marathon couples counseling sometimes. So, every now and again, I’ll have somebody for that.

[WHITNEY]:
So, you’re a busy guy.

[JOHN]:
Yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. So how do you stay organized and manage your time because you have kids too. And you’re married, right?

[JOHN]:
Yeah. I mean, the one is just my wife’s amazing. Definitely take time to give her a huge plug. We work as a pretty good team and have really looked at, like okay, this is what we’re comfortable with in terms of when I schedule clients and you know, we check in each… I mean, really every day, but definitely each week on our schedule of like, okay, this is what we got this week. Now, with quarantine, there’s no appointments going on outside of the house but on normal weeks, yeah, checking in on that kind of stuff. And then I just have set in place of like, okay, these are times that are blocked out that are non-negotiable, not available for clients, or not available for podcasting. And then I try to devote a set amount each week to my own notes and stuff, and then checking over discharge notes, or files, things like that. Yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. So, you’re kind of, it sounds like a little bit of time blocking for each thing that you’re doing. It’s kind of what I’m hearing and making sure you’re checking in with your spouse on making sure the load is bearable for each of you. It’s funny that you are talking about the COVID-19 and it’s like, yeah, there’s no meetings outside the house. But I find myself almost feeling equally as busy as I did in the office. Because I’m having to go into my office and say to my husband, okay, here’s the meeting for this child. And here’s the meeting for this child and can you handle this, and I’ll handle this, like, we’re kind of almost doing the same pattern just in a different format, I guess.

[JOHN]:
Well, I always use that building the airplane while flying it analogy, and we were already doing that with the business. But then with the COVID-19 and everything, like you know, completely changed the shape of the airplane.

[WHITNEY]:
Definitely.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, so I think definitely, as business owners and clinicians, you know, of course, a lot of people are scrambling to figure out the insurance side of things. And oh, now we have to put out, you know, all this COVID-19 content, and things like that. So yeah, I can definitely see where it’s, you know, really stressing a lot of clinicians out and it doesn’t seem like less work at all.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, yeah. I’ve been thinking about that, too. It was a little easy at the beginning to just kind of, okay, I’m gonna really dig in here. I’m gonna work hard. I’m going to get all this stuff done. And now that it’s been going on for a while it’s like, okay, I am tired.

[JOHN]:
It went from a sprint into a marathon.

[WHITNEY]:
That’s right. That’s right. And giving people permission, and this is what I’ve been saying to the people on Facebook, my followers and stuff, like, just relax, it’s gonna be okay, and take a deep breath, and you don’t have to do everything all at once. And the most important things obviously, our families and our clients, are being cared for. And you know, taking that deep breath is so important when you feel overwhelmed and busy.

[JOHN]:
Sure. Yeah. Yeah, definitely in the last couple of weeks with the quarantine I’ve had to focus a lot more on, oh, okay yeah, I actually do need to do the things that I tell my clients to do. And, you know, be intentional about self-care and where I’m going to spend my time and things like that.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, yeah. John, let’s move a little bit into your podcast. Could you tell people what it’s called and kind of the purpose of the podcast?

[JOHN]:
Sure. It’s the On The Couch podcast. And the elevator pitch I always give is mental and behavioral health, it’s more client facing, I would say, like, the general public, to try to educate them on really any topic that I feel connects in any way to mental and behavioral health. I’m always really interested in finding out about cool, interesting products or treatment methods or thought leaders in the mental health community and yeah, just trying to highlight things that people may not know about and connect listeners to it.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, that’s so needed, right? So needed. So, tell me how you kind of came up with the idea to start the podcast and how long have you been doing it?

[JOHN]:
So, I’m in my second season now, kind of in the middle of the second season. And yeah, I said the same thing to Allison. Basically, Joe Sanok told me to, was how I came to the idea. I always tell people, back then, especially in 2016, I never would have thought of blogging or podcasting or any of it; it just wasn’t even on my radar. And then through listening to Joe and starting to see a lot of the wisdom in what he teaches and see the fruits of the labor, I was like okay, yeah, it seems like it’s a good idea. And then on the podcasting end of it, it’s fun. You know, you get to connect to people that you wouldn’t normally have access to and just, hey, I’m interested in having Brenè Brown on the show, I’m gonna shoot them an email and see if see if they’ll take me up on it. You know, what have I got to lose? I’ve messaged Kristen Bell and like, I didn’t get a response as yet, but you know… I have kind of like a podcast bucket list of guests that I’m dying to have on.

[WHITNEY]:
Are you familiar with the Hustle and Flow Chart podcast?

[JOHN]:
Briefly, yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah, so those guys, I met them at Podfest just a few weeks back. And at the end of every email, they have an Excel sheet of their top 100 people they’re trying to get on their show. That way, every email that somebody gets, they can just look, and they’ve had random people be like, oh, I know that person. I can get them on your show. So anyway, just a like suggestion there that…

[JOHN]:
Yeah. That’s a good idea.

[WHITNEY]:
If that’s what you want, just start a list and send it out and see what happens with that.

[JOHN]:
Nice. Yeah, I definitely have the list. I just hadn’t thought of that idea of sending it out. I usually check in, I’m like, hey, you know, with the guest at the end, I’ll, hey, is there anybody else like I should know about or should have on the show or, you know, stuff like that.

[WHITNEY]:
That is really cool. Yeah. Okay. And so, you feel like the podcast, sounds like the podcast is going well and you’re growing with that. I mean, do you feel like you have to put a lot of time and energy into it or do you really enjoy that aspect of it?

[JOHN]:
I definitely have to put time and energy into it. I’ve been really blessed again, to, you know, God just kind of keeps putting people in my path that are able to help with, you know, some of the editing and post-production end of things that have a heck of a lot more experience than I do. I always say, you know, they make me come off as a lot smarter than I actually am and put together. But yeah, it does still take a fair amount of time in terms of reaching out to guests, and scheduling stuff. Like, you and I went back and forth a bit, trying to, you know, nail stuff down and then obviously, with the quarantine, everything went sideways with that.

[WHITNEY]:
It got a little distracting.

[JOHN]:
Little bit, yeah.

[WHITNEY]:
Well, I like what you just brought up about Joe and like, he encouraged you to do something and you did it, and then you had success in it. And I used to feel the same way – I’d listen to the Practice of the Practice podcast, that’s how I got into Practice of the Practice too. I remember standing in my driveway one day thinking, podcast, maybe I should listen to one about building a practice, because I felt pretty lonely in my practice. I was seeing clients, but I didn’t really know how to actually grow my caseload or anything. So, I started listening to it. And then I’d come back from my run and be like, oh, my gosh, I got so much to do, and would have all these ideas and excitement. But then I finally hired him as my own consultant and that was when my business seriously took off. So just speaking to the importance of like, you can get all this information and it’s great, but if you actually have a consultant that knows you and can speak right to you about the things that are happening within you like, wow, then stuff really happens.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, yeah. It’s been really interesting to see, and I’m really looking forward. I’ve not had the opportunity as yet, and Lord willing, there will be a Killin’It Camp, or a Slow Down School on the other side of this. I’d been talking with Joe about, like, hey, which one would be a good fit? What should I go to? And so, I chatted with him a little bit and figured out Slow Down School would probably be the better bang for the buck. And, you know, yet again, as we’ve said throughout this show, and then the quarantine happened.

[WHITNEY]:
That’s right, that’s right. Yeah, it will be interesting to see if Slow Down School happens. I was telling one of my consultants last week, I was like, if we can’t fly, I will get in my car, and you will come and meet me at my house and we will drive to Michigan, because I’m going to Slow Down School. Yeah, so I can kind of talk about that actually. So, the difference for anyone who is listening, doesn’t know what each of these events are, Slow Down School is a week-long event that happens outside of Traverse City, Michigan. That’s where Joe is actually, Joe Sanok. And it’s a week long and you meet at an all-boys school called the Leelanau School, and it’s right on the water of Michigan, which, for those of you that haven’t been to Michigan very often, or you live at the beach like I do, when I got to the beach of Michigan, I was like, man, this is different. Like, it just looks very different. But it’s beautiful. And the sun doesn’t go down till like 10 o’clock at night, which was crazy. So, some long summer days, but you spend the time slowing down for a few days and resting, and it is amazing how that brings so much innovative ideas, and creativity. It’s amazing. And actually, that’s where I got the idea of really becoming a consultant, was when I was at Slow Down School. And so, I can say it was kind of life changing for me on a spiritual level, but also on a business level as well. Anyway, after you slow down, you spend some time really, really digging in and doing some work on your business. And then you can kind of leave from there. So, it’s a really amazing time. It is hard to make that commitment, the financial and leaving your family but when I did it, it was totally worth it. So, it’s really built for people who are more in the six figure or higher range as far as building the practice is, and that they’re doing a lot more, they’re not really bootstrapping as much anymore. But they’re wanting to kind of work on their systems or work on a big idea while they’re there. And then some people go just because they need to get away, and they don’t really know what they’re going to work on, but they figure it out when they’re there.

So, it’s really an amazing… I’ve seen some people do some amazing things by going, like my favorite is Jessica Tapanna and like, she didn’t know what was going on, necessarily, but she got there, and people were like, oh, tell us about search engine optimization. And she was like, oh, I can tell you about that. And they were like, you need to start a business and she was like, what? I could do a business with this? And then she started Simplified SEO and has done amazing stuff. And her business makes even more income for her than she does her group practice. And that was all from going to Slow Down School.

That’s kind of it for that, but Killin’It Camp is for people… we are trying to do different tracks for Killin’It Camp, but it’s a little bit more for people that are in the bootstrapping, beginning phases. Or maybe they’re starting their group practices. And so, they’re really wanting to work hard on the practice. So, they’re really… you get there and you’re getting information immediately. It’s not a time to slow down. It’s a time to work hard. And it’s in Estes Park, and it’s in the month of October. And so yes, I’m really hoping we still have that as well. But that’s another really cool event. There’s a lot more people there. I think last year, we had about 100 people. Slow Down School is a much smaller, tight knit group, more like 15 to 20 people. But yeah, they are really cool events. And you’ll be motivated in your practice at the end, whichever one ends up working out.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, I mean, from connecting with Joe and Alison and other people that have been, yeah, I mean, I can’t speak highly enough about it. And so yeah, it’s definitely something I’m looking forward to and yeah, getting to the point of, you know, consultation and things like that, of working with consultants.

[WHITNEY]:
Yeah. Well, regardless if people are in the Practice of the Practice community, or any community, like, having a community to build a practice with makes the world of difference, especially, I found when I come into times where I don’t know what to do – having a community that I can turn to ask for help is huge. Well, that was a little sidetrack, but that was good. So, John, I ask everyone on the podcast, what do you believe that every Christian counselor needs to know?

[JOHN]:
I think the majority of us need to know that… one, knowing yourself and what do you want and what don’t you want, and then taking that time to really think on it and pray on it. And I think the other is, you can have a business and be a Christian. And it’s not this like, sleazy, you know, tax collector like Zacchaeus or, you know, snake oil, used car salesman kind of thing, that you can do both. And it’s okay to be good at it and be successful at it and be confident in that. And it’s not that the two are you know, you can’t have one with the other. Does that make sense?

[WHITNEY]:
Oh yeah, I think that’s great advice. Yeah. So, John, if somebody wants to get in touch with you, how can they do that?

[JOHN]:
Yeah, so the easiest way I would say is probably through email. Just the JDennis@parentfamilysolutions.com, and then yeah, if you just search for On The Couch podcast or parenting and family solutions on pretty much all those social media platforms, haven’t quite ventured into Tiktok just yet, but I’ll probably hold off on that.

[WHITNEY]:
You might want to hold off on that. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story about your practice and about your faith on the podcast today.

[JOHN]:
Yeah, thanks so much for having me on.

[WHITNEY]:
Thank you for listening to the Faith in Practice podcast. If you love this podcast, please rate and review on iTunes or your favorite podcast player. If you liked this episode and want to know more, check out the Practice of the Practice website. Also, there you can learn more about me, options for working together such as individual and group consulting, or just shoot me an e-mail whitney@practiceofthepractice.com. We’d love to hear from you.

This podcast is designed to provide accurate and authoritative information in regard to the subject matter covered. This is given with the understanding that neither the host, the Practice of the Practice, or the guests, are providing legal, mental health, or other professional information. If you need a professional, you should find one.

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